There are three things I have learned never to discuss with people: religion, politics, and The Great Pumpkin.

– Linus, Peanuts

Well Linus, I tackled religion in my last post so it only seems appropriate that I hit politics next.  Much like religion, I’ve been thinking about writing on this for a long time; it’s just such a large and potentially sensitive subject that I never dedicated any time to it.  However, I was prompted (once again) by a discussion I had with a stranger last night:

I mostly debate politics with convervatives/republicans when I’m out; folks who are older and white(r) and male.  I ran into a fellow last night – white, 48 y.o., and a business owner.  He didn’t give off the normal Deep South, southern attitude; he also gave off no redneck vibe.  He said that he was an independent and that he had actually done his research and was well-informed on the constitution (carries it with him!) and politics.  He runs a medical device company in the area and caught my attention when he started going off about healthcare reform and how much he hated it, and Obama.  I naturally wove myself into the conversation and asked him what he felt was terrible about it.  Among other things, he felt that the reform was going to bankrupt the insurance companies and that all of our taxes would go up by 20% in order to cover the insurance.

20%, really?   Seems like a bit much.  Especially since many people pay that, or less, IN TOTAL for their income tax.  I started asking him how in the world our taxes were going to double simply due to the mandate.  He started explaining, but it was so tangental that I had problems keeping up with him.  I think he was quoting research he had done, but I hadn’t heard that high tax mentioned until this point and was unsure what his sources were.

He explained to me that, as a business owner who works in medical devices, he spends a lot of his time reading and hearing about healthcare news.  Fine, this sounds promising – I’m interested to know what he’s found out.  He then went back to the idea that the insurance companies will soon be bankrupt, which I had to press the pause button on.  Knowing what I know about insurance companies and their high profits and their countless lobbyists, I was finding it hard to believe that they would collapse anytime soon.

And then he told me that all the banks were going to collapse.

And that Obama was an idiot and a criminal and should be impeached.

And that a Saudi Arabian Prince paid for Obama’s Harvard education (“look it up!”  I did.  And I found no legitimate support for it.)

And that Obama has no “American Values” because he was raised in Indonesia and Hawaii(not the US?) and that only people born in the US of A could have “American Values.”  “Why does Romney have Amerian Values?” I asked.  “Because he was born here!” he exclaimed.  I brought up the absurdity of Obama’s mother having created this “conspiracy” of his birthplace since day one because, you know, she KNEW he would be running for Prez one day.  “It’s a certifciate of live birth!  That means nothing!” he exclaimed.  I also brought up the stupidity of saying that someone has American Values SIMPLY because they are born on our soil (genetic?).

And that we might as well vote for Romney because things can’t get any worse than they are.  “But things can alwasy get worse, no?”  I asked. How was he so certain that Romney would be a positive change?  And he was quick to say that he didn’t know, that he was just going with the idea that anything is better than what we have.  Sure.  Ok.

But it gets better/weirder!

He then goes on to say that there’s NOTHING we can do to stop the demise of the United States.

“Nothing?” I asked.

“Nothing,” he repeats.

Well now, that it quite the defeatest attitude.  You’re saying that the country is going to self-destruct but but there’s nothing we can do about it.  Not even voting for Romney (which we should still do, simply because they can’t get worse.  but wait, he already said they can, and will).  We’re effectively a trainwreck with no breaks to fix.

So what’s your political view again?

He hates Obama; he hated Bush.  He thinks all government is corrupt, but has no solution on what to do.  None.  In the half-hour we spoke, I came up with quite a few ways to work backwards to get rid of some of the corruption.  Although, like him, I  had to agree that I didn’t know how we could unite as a people to fight the corporations and lobbyists with unlimited funds who ultimately control our government.  He seemed to agree with some thoughts I had, which made it all the stranger to me that he had never spent time focusing on a solution.  Just focused on complaining.   Loudly.

At least I try, people!  At least I realize that there is corruption on both sides and that it’s going to take a lot of unraveling to correct it.  It was really disheartening to see someone so negative and defeated regarding the future.  I mean, if you’re not even going to try to come up with a solution, stop bitching about the problems.

In another spin in the debate, he told me that there are five groups of people that are liberal.  This I gotta hear.

1.  Minorities (Bingo!  You can stop there, I told him. I’m done!)

2.  Students (those educated asses)

3.  Professors (those asses trying to futher educate the other asses)

4.  Artists (I’ll cover that in a minute – entirely another topic!)

5.  Gays

Now, he was quite hesitant to tell me that last group because he “didn’t want to be politically incorrect.”  I literally laughed out loud (not the first time in our discussion) and let him know that he crossed that line ages ago.  I then went on to guess the final group – only took two tries.

Ahem.  This is quite the group of folks these crazy liberals are, ain’t it?  I was completely intrigued by this man’s views; I mean, like, write a whole disseration on his madness, intrigued.

Going back to artists and art, we gotta rewind.

This fellow was originally talking to my friend – gay male, hair dresser, and “mayor” of DeLand.  I say this because he knew every.single.person that walked into the bar.  They all came up, hugged him, shared a laugh.  So the fellow brings up the idea of art to my gay friend, telling him that “all art could be wiped from existence and we would continue to function with no issues.”

Yes.  He said it.

My friend had a quizzical look on his face and brought up the fact that language itself began with cave drawings…you know, ART.  The fellow continues talking, saying that artists contribute nothing real to society.  “What I do is real!  I make decisions that affect people and families!  All an artists has to decide is how to mold their next sculpture!”

THIS was in the point in the conversation when I started laughing.  It was more like a hoot.

My friend then brings up the fact that he himself is an artist and also has to make “real” decisions.  All the time.  The fellow brings up the point that he does photography as a side job, takes pics of the Orlando ballet, and is just all too familiar with artists.  I mean, why else would he make a statement like that?  He’s an artists himself!

So back to wiping art of the face of the earth.  My friend, wisely, gets up and moves to a different part of the bar, wanting nothing to do with our debate (we’d gone political at that point).  I wanted to yell, “Come back!  This affects YOU.  He’s talking about THE GAYS!!  And THE ARTISTS!!”

Yeah, I tend to get a little worked up when it comes to discussions.  And I just couldn’t understand why you couldn’t want to argue about something that directly speaks about you and who you are.  However, I then realized that some people don’t want to discuss politics – ever – and it doesn’t matter if it’s about slandering who they are.  That’s fine, I’m ok with that.  To each their own.  I’ve got a loud enough voice for us all 🙂

The fellow believes that the first thing to go in a failing society should be the arts.  I then brought up the fact that during The Great Depression, and other periods of economic depression, more people actually went to the movies – to escape!  Arts and entertainment had a very important function during these times; they lifted the spirits of the people.  People who needed something to look forward to when the rest of their lives were pretty miserable.  So even though he might want to get rid of the arts first, that certainly isn’t what happens.  What actually happens?  We get rid of our public services – teachers, police, fireman.

He agreed with me.

Furthermore, the wealthy love the arts!  Who’s sitting up front at the opera, who’s paying millions for an original Van Gough?  The rich!  So even as the rest of us are living out a recession – and the rich stay rich or get richer – the wealthy continue to spend on luxeries, like arts and entertainment.

He agreed with me.

In the end, we decided to end the debate because it wasn’t good conversation (for those suffering beside us).  We were actually very friendly during the whole debate – I, laughing at the ridiculous mess coming out of his mouth – and he, just stating the things he believes.  I felt it was a pretty healthy debate, in that I was able to find out where he was coming from (mostly) and put some new ideas in front of him.

Ok, so this whole post was one big tangent and really didn’t hit all the points I wanted.  That’s ok, I just really needed to get that conversation off my chest.  I can just write another post on politics in general – or a million, since, you know, I OWN THIS.

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A little background on this 30 Rock quote.  In Season 2, staunch Republican Jack Donaghy dates C.C. Cunningham (played by the fantastic Edie Falco), a Democratic Congresswoman from Vermont.   They keep it a secret at first, because C.C. is part of a suit against a division of NBC Universal, where Jack is a VP.  And while they have polar opposite views on politics, they can’t help the phyiscal attraction they feel for one another.

Jack:  What are you doing in Harlem?

C.C.:  Oh, I’m working out of the Clinton offices for a few weeks.  I’m helping Hillary retool her universal healthcare platform.

Jack:  God, I want to kiss you on the mouth to stop you from saying such ridiculous things.